Interview: Ramin Bahrani

With all of the praise Ramin Bahrani has received since his debut film Man Push Cart was released in 2005, like Roger Ebert proclaiming his debut is on par with Martin Scorsese’s Mean Streets, as a vital new voice in cinema, one can forget that he has made these films without the help of studio financing.

As a multiple nominated Independent Spirit Award nominee, Bahrani has championed his status within the American independent system, and has made three of the better American films that you perhaps haven’t caught. With the release of his third film, Goodbye Solo, on DVD today, Ramin Bahrani took some time away from his work on his untitled fourth film, and his new short Plastic Bag, to chat with me on Killer Film.

Jon Peters: In 2006, at Roger Ebert’s Ebertfest, you mentioned how many potential investors told you no for financing Goodbye Solo, and that you had to keep trying to find someone who believes in the project. Can you explain this process a bit more thoroughly?

Ramin Bahrani: The process is I move forward regardless of with or without money, because I don’t think money makes films, I think it’s people, rather a team of people, who believe in something, regardless of what the world says. I’ve made all my films this way and somehow they got made, and they all have been distributed and thankfully seen. I think it’s important, especially for young filmmakers not to censor their imagination for financial reasons, or pressures the world insist upon.

Jon: Now the opening scene of the film was done in about 25 takes. This is perhaps normal for a studio produced film, since those pictures have ample funds, but I’ve got to imagine it put a strain of such a low budgeted indie. Can you explain this relationship between the budget and the work ethic of the production?

Bahrani: The first scene is done many, many times, because it is one continuous shot. It’s the first scene of the film to grab your attention, so they can get invested into the characters. It’s something that is exciting for the actors, as they really respond acting against each other. I think the audience responded favorably. One of the ways films are made with a relatively modest budget is I do a lot of work myself. I do the casting and location work by myself, occasionally with a handful of people, and we didn’t waste money on unneeded things, and were really committed to making the film.

Jon: Goodbye Solo is a fantastic film, I might add. I’m sure people will find out more through your audio commentary on the film when it hits DVD, but I’m fascinated by your approach to filming this movie. Can you explain how you developed the style you’ve used here, as well as in Man Push Cart and Chop Shop?

Bahrani: Well, for the most part the three films, more so than any of them, it’s a classical style of film making. There is nothing extravagant about the camera; we tried to be very simple, very straightforward camera work, that’s more observational. That means there isn’t a lot of tracking shots or an excessive amount of editing or music. I really don’t want to be the star of the film, but for the characters or the story to be the star, and have the audience get invested in the emotional truths of the characters, and get moved by that, not by me the filmmaker.

Saying these things, it doesn’t mean the story is slow or not engaging, I’m glad audiences found it to be very engaging. It’s very tricky to do, when your staying simple. Trying to be true to the characters and what they are about, and hiding falsehoods, tricky camera work, music, but staying true as you can.

Jon: Red West and Souleymane Sy Savane are great in this, but they also are your first so-called professional actors. What made you go from non-actors in Man Push Cart and Chop Shop, to a casting call? Was it the script and the emotional need within the script?

Bahrani: To some degree yes. We did look for professionally trained actors for those two parts, and they just weren’t there. The part for Souleymane was actually for the real cab driver I followed around, but there came a time when he really didn’t want to be involved. He was a very humble person, and didn’t want the attention, though it matched his character. It ended up being a blessing, as Souleymane is very talented, and has moved on to a play on Broadway, then working on a new film.

Red West is just phenomenal in the movie, and I’m sure you know about his history with Elvis, being a stunt man with him, and that venturesome life really shows on his face, a man who has really lived. He might not be able to tolerate horrific things, like being in a nursing home.

Jon: After filming Chop Shop in New York, can you explain what it was like coming back home to Winston-Salem to film Goodbye Solo?

Bahrani: Oh, I really enjoyed it! I’ve always wanted to make a film in my home town. I was born and raised in Winston-Salem. I have a lot of people insist I’m Iranian, but I’m American, born and raised here. I’ve made all my films here, and I hope they’re seen as deeply American, about the fundamentals of what makes America great. It was a blessing. North Carolina is known for a lot of things, and one of them is hospitality, and they couldn’t be more hospitable. One of the differences in the film making process was unlike New York that was incredibly crowded; just constant action and busyness, with cars and people all over in the frame. North Carolina is very suburban, and Winston-Salem is really sparse and so the landscape became like their faces. Luckily, Red and Souleymane have great faces

Blowing Rock is really where the landscape becomes central to the story. It’s a real place, known for its powerful winds. I’ve been going there since I was a kid, throwing sticks off of the rock. It’s a very special part of the film, Blowing Rock

Jon: Yeah, it is. Can you talk about filming there? I imagine it was pretty dangerous have your leads so close to the edge as they were, with the wind gusts.

Bahrani: Well, it was more dangerous than I realized. I didn’t know that Souleymane had a fear of heights! I had no idea when we made the film. He didn’t tell anyone. He also didn’t tell us that he couldn’t drive a car. We learned that pretty quickly, because he was an awful driver (laughs).

It took him like four times to get his license days before rehearsal began. He arrived in Winston-Salem and we began rehearsals, and Michael Simmons, who shot all of my films, and myself thought he was a really bad driver. Later, after filming, he confessed he didn’t get his license only days beforehand.

Jon: You’ve said your films are about hope, but are realistic in the realization of that. I find your films to be really American, culturally speaking . We’re a melting pot society, and while your films focus on foreigners, they are in fact Americans. We get this stereotypical imagery of America being a white, Christian nation, but characters like Ale [from Chop Shop]and Solo, are just as American as I am. What is it about American society that you find so appealing to create characters like Solo and Ale, let alone showing them in these environments that aren’t typically thought of, when we think of the clichéd American landscape?

Bahrani: I appreciate you saying that, and I think that the cliché comes from cinema being bored with itself, and their films. With the same stories, and images seen over and over again, it’s become hard to tolerate those films. They don’t provide us with anything fresh, and don’t resemble any world I live in or know about. And for worlds I don’t know about, I prefer for them not to be made by a computer.

One of the things that I think are distinctively American about the three characters [in Man Push Cart, Chop Shop, and Goodbye Solo] is firmness in their individuality. They’re all immigrants, of course, but it’s what’s made this country, as you correctly said, and is continually being remade, with the new populations of people. We’re seeing that politically now in our last election, and part of that is America’s fierce individualism, which has its positives and negatives. Here, its positives are the characters don’t seem to be connected to their parents culture, nor adapt to anything else, but strictly their own. This is for good or for bad, I really like that about all three of them.

Jon: Getting back to what you said about Hollywood films and their cliches…

Bahrani: I really want to clarify here. Not just in Hollywood, but in films in general, “Hollywood independents” have over the last decade, become very blurry. A lot of people are being tricked about what is an independent film. Even if it’s financed independently in the studio system, but doesn’t mean it is independent. An independent is created by an independence of vision, and a lot of what is being called an independent film, for me, doesn’t look any different from a studio film. It’s just financed in different ways. It’s very tough to read and an audience is tricked into what is an independent film, and it’s not really different from a studio film. It’s just made with a little less money, that’s all.

Jon: When a director thrives in the independent film making world, like yourself, fans of cinema are protective of that, and fear the leap-frog to Hollywood. Has there been a desire to go from these personal little films, to doing a studio feature? If so, do you think your style would be welcomed in that system or clash with it?

Bahrani: I have many projects that I’m working on, and one of them I want to do next year, and it’s a western. It’s done in my way, and doesn’t resemble a western that we’ve seen before. I like to remain independent and protected, and do what I want to do. Could that happen in a studio film? Probably not. I’m already working putting the cast together, and maintaining my independence, although I have had a great time collaborating.

Even with more established producers like those for Little Miss Sunshine, are the producers of Chop Shop. They were great to work with. They had great ideas and respected what I wanted to do, and I respect them as well. These are things that had do happen. The western is going to be a larger project with more known actors, and I still believe that it will be something fresh.

Jon: Can you talk about your new short film and your participation with the Venice Film Festival?

Bahrani: Oh, I’m excited to talk about that. We just finished the mix on it last night. The movie is about a plastic bag going on an epic journey to find its lost Maker, in the not-to-distant-future. It ends up going on a strange adventure, meeting strange creatures, and a brief love affair in the sky. It ends up with some other bags in a vortex, this real place, where this garbage has gathered. It’s a real thing, you can read about this North Pacific Trash Vortex, and the film is written with Jenni Jenkins. Of course it has ecological themes, but it is not an agenda film, otherwise it will not be good, though it that’s a part of it. It features an original score from Kjartan Sveinsson, the keyboardist for the Icelandic band Sigur Ros. The voice of the bag is someone very, very special and really well known. It’s a surprise for the premiere, so I cannot say. It is someone who I’ve respected and admired since I was a teenager, and hopefully, after the premiere you will hear who it is, and see it soon.

What happened with Venice, was my first film premiere there, then Chop Shop in Cannes, then for Goodbye Solo back at Venice, and I received a Jury Prize there from critics. The head of the festival asked if I wanted to be on the jury for Best First Film, so I’m excited for that. So the short will open the Shorts Section on Opening Night, but won’t be in competition, due to my responsibilities on the jury for Best First Film. Yeah, it will be fun. I never been on a jury before and I’m looking forward to watching some good films.

Jon: Finally, can you talk about the nature of the film being made, hitting theater screens, then back to DVD, the whole cycle of that as a filmmaker?

Bahrani: The theatrical release was handled by Roadside, and they did a really phenomenal job. It was important, so audiences could see it on the big screen with an audience, and that always makes it enjoyable. Lionsgate is doing an amazing job on the DVD, and I really liked their artwork, and their energy into really making the DVD good. It’s great because the film had a limited release, and now gives audiences a chance who didn’t see it, because they lived in a small town, or heard about it on the Internet, so it’s exciting. I’m looking forward to it getting a new reception.

Goodbye Solo is now out on DVD thanks to Lionsgate. If you like, feel free to leave a comment or email me at jon@killerfilm.com .